Podcast:
The Epstein Files, Family Division and Finding Jesus in a World of Hatred | Cross Examined Ep. 13

00:00:00.160 Welcome to Cross-examine with the
00:00:01.360 Gerbers. I’m Ken Gerber and this is my
00:00:03.040 wife, Megan Gerber.
00:00:04.160 >> I am
00:00:09.200 >> Well, welcome to the podcast. We like to
00:00:11.120 bring together our faith, our family,
00:00:13.920 the practice of law, and our ministry
00:00:15.839 with Tones and Bones all in one place
00:00:17.600 and we talk about a lot of different
00:00:18.960 things here. Megan, how have you been?
00:00:21.039 >> Not good.
00:00:22.240 >> I know.
00:00:23.199 >> My ears plugged right now.
00:00:24.400 >> You’ve been struggling lately.
00:00:25.760 >> Yeah, I’ve had some health issues.
00:00:27.680 >> Yeah. Been knocked you out. down and
00:00:29.760 out.
00:00:30.160 >> Yeah.
00:00:30.800 >> Well, it’s been a tough thing. Been a
00:00:33.920 struggle. You’re feeling a little bit
00:00:35.200 better now. I’m glad about that.
00:00:36.399 >> Well, I have something called
00:00:37.360 intercalcyitis.
00:00:39.360 Yeah.
00:00:39.680 >> If you guys want to look it up, it’s a
00:00:42.000 it’s a chronic condition with your
00:00:43.840 bladder. So, for all of you that have
00:00:45.920 had bladder infections, females mainly,
00:00:47.760 it feels like you have a constant
00:00:49.039 bladder infection, but no infection. But
00:00:51.520 in the end, it did actually have a
00:00:53.840 little infection. So they prescri I’m
00:00:56.879 allergic to so many things and they
00:01:01.199 prescribed me a medication that started
00:01:03.760 to close my throat on the fourth dose
00:01:06.320 which was not fun and I’ve been living
00:01:09.520 on benadryil which knocks me out for the
00:01:12.240 last month. You know the world doesn’t
00:01:14.400 stop when you’re not feeling good.
00:01:17.360 >> Yeah. But thank God that you know I have
00:01:19.600 the support system with you and the kids
00:01:22.159 and stuff and everybody that works for
00:01:24.080 us that you know they help us out. But
00:01:28.720 I’m just kind of tired. Anyways, that’s
00:01:32.240 I’m emotionally tired too. Yeah,
00:01:34.560 >> we were just talking about it with our
00:01:36.079 producer Aaron that like I get so sick
00:01:40.479 of people that we’re close to, like
00:01:43.360 friends that come to our house that know
00:01:46.159 us that are like I don’t get it. Like
00:01:49.600 these people that don’t know you, they
00:01:51.840 always are like, "Why are you friends
00:01:53.119 with them? They’re so snobby." And
00:01:56.479 they’re like, "Wait a minute. No,
00:01:59.119 they’re not." Like they’re the kindest,
00:02:01.520 most loving people. like if it weren’t
00:02:05.119 for them x y and z in my life like they
00:02:07.920 haven’t judged me. They’ve been just
00:02:09.840 there for me and I I don’t know.
00:02:14.319 >> It’s so weird too because you’re right.
00:02:16.400 It comes from people who
00:02:19.360 >> don’t know us who are just
00:02:21.280 >> tangentially exposed to us
00:02:23.920 >> and they make these snap judgments about
00:02:26.480 us and and it’s
00:02:28.720 >> well it was interesting. One of Skyla’s
00:02:30.239 friends was here the other night and
00:02:31.920 Skyla’s gone to school with her for a
00:02:33.519 long time and there was actually two
00:02:34.640 friends here and she said, "You know
00:02:36.800 what? I find so interesting cuz they
00:02:38.959 know the same people. The people that
00:02:41.680 actually say bad things about you
00:02:44.959 don’t aren’t very godly. They’re the
00:02:47.440 ones who blame you. But yet, I’ve known
00:02:50.319 you guys for so long and you guys are
00:02:52.480 really such sweet, kind, giving people.
00:02:55.200 I I really don’t get the phenomenon.
00:02:58.720 Like if you were to actually and these
00:03:01.200 are 15year-olds that are saying that
00:03:04.080 that they see these adults say these
00:03:06.879 things about us, but yet they come to
00:03:10.720 our house and they’re like, "You guys
00:03:12.400 are saying these things, but they’re
00:03:14.239 not. It’s not true." Like the Gerbers
00:03:16.640 are so sweet to us and there’s like I
00:03:19.760 just I don’t have an answer for it
00:03:21.760 anymore. Like I had to look up the word
00:03:24.400 snobby because like I I mean what does
00:03:29.120 that really mean? Like to better than
00:03:31.680 somebody else or whatever. And you know
00:03:33.599 I looked at the word snobby and these
00:03:36.319 other words came out which I definitely
00:03:38.640 feel we are because we are business
00:03:41.360 owners in the valley. I think we have to
00:03:43.680 always be representing who we are but
00:03:47.360 also a professionalism to everyone. I
00:03:50.640 mean that’s that’s just me as a person.
00:03:52.560 I would like to be professional with
00:03:54.239 people. We are refined. I think that we
00:03:57.360 care about how we come off and we like
00:04:00.799 to take care of ourselves.
00:04:02.720 >> I am confident. I wouldn’t be able to do
00:04:04.799 the businesses that I’m doing if I
00:04:06.560 wasn’t confident in my ability. But that
00:04:08.799 doesn’t mean I think I’m better than you
00:04:10.239 or you think you’re better than somebody
00:04:11.840 else. No,
00:04:12.720 >> we are discerning. You know, when you do
00:04:15.760 own a business,
00:04:17.918 a lot of people come at you and you have
00:04:21.680 to get tough skin. So, if being
00:04:24.400 discerning and having tough skin and and
00:04:27.840 kind of weeding out those that are are
00:04:30.400 coming for different reasons than really
00:04:32.800 being your friend, if that’s snobby,
00:04:36.160 I I I guess maybe that’s snobby,
00:04:39.199 sophisticated,
00:04:41.280 elegant, self-respecting.
00:04:43.680 I mean, if those things are snobby, then
00:04:46.160 I guess we’re snobby. I honestly,
00:04:51.600 my heart says otherwise. Like, I love
00:04:55.600 people. I feel like I want to
00:04:58.320 communicate. I feel like maybe my
00:05:01.120 communication
00:05:03.040 creates them to make them feel
00:05:05.360 uncomfortable because I just I don’t
00:05:08.400 know. You know, we talked in one of the
00:05:10.320 the recent podcasts with one of our
00:05:12.800 guests that there’s a lot of greed in
00:05:14.800 the church. There’s a lot of jealousy in
00:05:17.120 the church. And it shows itself in all
00:05:21.759 areas of life, all walks of life, people
00:05:23.680 that you come in contact with. And it’s
00:05:25.360 not just those things, but the it’s a
00:05:27.520 lot of judgment. It’s a lot of snap
00:05:29.199 judgment that people are making. And
00:05:31.440 it’s important for people to realize
00:05:34.479 that
00:05:36.560 there’s a lot that goes deeper. And when
00:05:39.120 they see somebody like us, you know,
00:05:42.000 yeah, we run businesses. Are people
00:05:44.400 going to trust us with their case at the
00:05:48.240 law firm? Are people going to want to
00:05:51.039 listen to us on the podcast? Are people
00:05:53.120 going to want to trust their kids coming
00:05:56.000 to Tones and Bones if we don’t present
00:05:59.759 ourselves as we actually are that hey,
00:06:02.720 you know what? We we take responsibility
00:06:04.720 seriously. We take all of all of what
00:06:07.440 God’s providing for us and allowing us
00:06:10.000 to to steward very very seriously. And
00:06:13.520 so we we present ourselves that way
00:06:16.000 because that’s who we are. And it’s
00:06:18.160 important that we are presenting
00:06:19.600 ourselves that way. And what people
00:06:22.240 don’t know is I actually have my
00:06:24.000 cosmetology degree. I love doing hair. I
00:06:27.039 love doing makeup. I love beauty. So I
00:06:31.039 love dressing up. I’m not dressing up to
00:06:34.560 look better than anyone else.
00:06:36.720 >> I like that you dress up.
00:06:37.840 >> Well, thank you. But I mean I I
00:06:40.319 literally enjoy it. And if you don’t
00:06:42.479 want to dress up, I I don’t care. I’m
00:06:46.080 never sitting like could I sit there and
00:06:48.960 say,
00:06:50.720 you know, we’re at a wedding and
00:06:52.000 someone’s in a bathing suit cover up.
00:06:54.880 Sure, of course. I’m going to be like,
00:06:56.479 you know, like anybody. When we went to
00:06:59.039 Poland, there were women there that
00:07:01.280 immediately didn’t like me, thinking I
00:07:03.039 thought I was better than them.
00:07:04.240 >> And they didn’t know you. They had no
00:07:06.160 conversation with you whatsoever.
00:07:07.919 >> I have no idea why. And and and they
00:07:10.479 would think that I would know why. I
00:07:12.240 think, but I don’t. I mean, I am a very
00:07:17.680 outgoing person, but at the same time,
00:07:20.560 I’m reserved to a certain degree. I
00:07:23.919 don’t know you. I would love to get to
00:07:26.080 know you, but I maybe me being reserved
00:07:29.919 in the way that I look, I come off as
00:07:31.840 not wanting to know you, but that’s not
00:07:34.720 true.
00:07:35.440 >> No. Anybody who does spend a couple of
00:07:38.000 minutes with you realizes you’ve never
00:07:41.680 met anybody that you can’t become
00:07:43.440 instant best friends with. When people
00:07:46.400 think that I think that I’m better than
00:07:48.800 them, I mean, maybe that’s the snobby
00:07:51.440 part. I’m not thinking about them. I’m
00:07:54.720 thinking about me presenting me the
00:07:56.800 best. I’m thinking about how I can be
00:07:59.039 the best me for them. I’m not judging
00:08:01.680 them. I’m not looking at them and
00:08:05.199 thinking they could be doing something
00:08:07.280 different. I’m sitting there thinking to
00:08:09.840 myself, what can I do for this person?
00:08:12.479 How can I help this person? How can I be
00:08:15.840 a loving, godly person to this person?
00:08:19.199 And
00:08:20.960 I I don’t have an answer. I I literally
00:08:24.240 I don’t have an answer.
00:08:25.919 >> Well, you’re you’re literally
00:08:28.560 following Jesus’s words. You’re
00:08:31.039 literally
00:08:31.599 >> to the best of my do to the best of my
00:08:33.360 ability. I’m not people
00:08:35.599 >> as you love yourself.
00:08:37.200 >> I’m not perfect. I do want to love them
00:08:39.599 and I want to understand them and that
00:08:43.120 can get uncomfortable. I mean,
00:08:44.480 >> and I think I think a lot of people look
00:08:46.560 at it as well and they’re skeptical of
00:08:49.680 somebody uh loving them in that way.
00:08:53.200 They feel like what are you trying to
00:08:55.120 get over them? What are you trying to
00:08:56.480 pull off? And they’re they’re
00:08:58.320 distrusting. And that’s that’s really a
00:09:00.240 shame.
00:09:00.720 >> Well, what’s funny is like people see
00:09:02.720 our family, right? The kids love me to
00:09:05.600 death. You love me to death. Women are
00:09:07.920 like, "Why are you so obsessed with me?"
00:09:10.080 But they don’t see what we do behind
00:09:12.480 closed doors.
00:09:13.600 >> No.
00:09:14.160 >> How affectionate I am towards you, how
00:09:17.360 much I am communicating to you, how like
00:09:21.760 they don’t see that. So they don’t get
00:09:23.920 that level of me because they’re not
00:09:28.160 taking the time to really get to know
00:09:30.959 me,
00:09:31.600 >> right?
00:09:32.720 >> And I can’t change that if you
00:09:35.839 automatically think that I’m somebody
00:09:37.760 that wouldn’t like you.
00:09:39.600 >> No. Bottom line is people need to hold
00:09:43.040 back on the judgment. They need to give
00:09:45.519 people an opportunity to present who
00:09:48.320 they actually are. You need to just
00:09:51.040 allow people to be themselves and and
00:09:55.760 not
00:09:57.519 Yeah. make snap judgments. Judge not,
00:10:00.640 lest ye be judged. Yeah.
00:10:02.320 >> Right. So, I guess,
00:10:03.680 >> you know, they they always talk about,
00:10:05.680 well, these people don’t want to be
00:10:07.200 friends with you because they’re
00:10:08.080 jealous. I can’t see anything of them
00:10:09.600 being jealous about for me. Like, I
00:10:11.680 don’t like I’m not this person that
00:10:14.480 thinks people are jealous of me. I can’t
00:10:17.120 ever think that. I can’t ever wrap my
00:10:19.519 head around that. Maybe if someone can’t
00:10:23.200 have kids, they are jealous of the fact
00:10:26.399 that I have kids. But I don’t see like
00:10:29.040 yes, if someone is in ill health, they
00:10:32.560 think, oh well, she she is healthy or
00:10:35.600 someone that lost somebody, you know,
00:10:37.600 maybe lost their spouse, they are still
00:10:39.680 married. But like just me, I don’t think
00:10:43.760 of myself that way. I don’t think of
00:10:46.000 myself as somebody to be jealous about.
00:10:48.079 Every day I fight my own demons. Every
00:10:50.320 day I’m struggling to be above water. So
00:10:53.200 many times life can get so hard where I
00:10:55.920 just cry in your arms wanting to be the
00:10:59.040 person that everyone thinks I should be
00:11:01.360 or I shouldn’t be. And I’m
00:11:03.200 self-evaluating myself all the time. And
00:11:07.440 I just I I’m getting to the point where
00:11:10.160 I I don’t have an answer for people. If
00:11:13.600 you think I’m snobby, then I’m snobby.
00:11:15.920 If you want to get to know me more, then
00:11:17.440 get to know me more. But I
00:11:19.040 >> And you’re actually open to it.
00:11:20.720 >> Yes. I I I I literally don’t think of
00:11:24.720 anyone as below me. I think of people as
00:11:28.320 having different of opinions. I think
00:11:30.720 that people live different lifestyles,
00:11:33.360 but I don’t think of any I think of
00:11:35.120 everyone side by side. I’m not thinking
00:11:37.920 of anyone as below me. I think of them
00:11:41.440 as different. I think there’s so much
00:11:43.760 that that society is dealing with these
00:11:47.040 days with the social media phenomenon
00:11:49.360 where we’re so used to people just
00:11:51.839 posting the best of themselves and
00:11:54.959 nobody really thinks beyond that and
00:11:57.920 they think that what they see is that
00:12:00.720 person’s life in total. And you’re great
00:12:02.640 about it. You post whatever. You post
00:12:04.640 anything, the good, the bad, whatever
00:12:06.880 online. But I think a lot of people what
00:12:09.440 gets people’s attention is what
00:12:13.680 they either are jealous of, envious of,
00:12:17.519 or they dislike or disagree with. The
00:12:20.240 real hot button issues, the ones that
00:12:22.639 stir some emotion. And so they’re
00:12:25.120 limited. And you might post something
00:12:26.720 that’s, you know, a memory of, you know,
00:12:29.519 the kids sitting at the dinner table or
00:12:31.760 something like that and it’s not that
00:12:33.760 exciting. and they might just scroll
00:12:35.200 past that because it doesn’t evoke some
00:12:37.360 kind of strong emotion with them. But
00:12:39.760 when you post something that’s political
00:12:42.000 or you post something that we’re on a a
00:12:44.800 vacation or out at a dinner or something
00:12:46.800 like that, then it’s going to stir that
00:12:48.880 emotion or that envy or jealousy or rage
00:12:51.519 or anger, you know, opposition. And
00:12:54.240 those are the things that people hold on
00:12:55.680 to. So, I think a lot of it is the
00:12:57.920 social media phenomenon where people are
00:12:59.839 picking and choosing what they know
00:13:02.079 about you and how they’re deciding who
00:13:04.639 you are and and realistically, nobody is
00:13:08.320 just what they post on social media.
00:13:10.399 Nobody is just what they talk about in a
00:13:13.200 brief conversation. Get to know
00:13:15.279 somebody.
00:13:15.839 >> Well, and it makes people not want to
00:13:17.519 put themselves out there.
00:13:19.040 >> Sure. It’s safer to be in your four
00:13:21.760 walls and not putting yourself out there
00:13:24.639 and
00:13:26.160 not allowing people to see your heart
00:13:28.079 and see who you are. And you keep safe
00:13:31.600 that way, but you’re not building
00:13:34.480 connections. You’re not building
00:13:36.160 bridges. I guess I’ll get a a black eye
00:13:40.079 so that people can understand one
00:13:41.680 another. I’m going to get in the ring
00:13:43.519 and get mudslinged at me. And I’m not
00:13:46.880 right about everything. And I want to
00:13:48.800 have open communications. I want to
00:13:50.880 learn. You know, I realized that one of
00:13:54.800 my family members, multiple, stopped
00:13:57.040 talking to me in Illinois. I actually
00:13:58.720 sent a text to my aunt saying, "I’m so
00:14:02.000 sorry. This is how I feel. I love you
00:14:04.320 very much. Please communicate to me what
00:14:07.920 happened." This was a year ago. She
00:14:09.760 never replied to me.
00:14:10.560 >> Full on ignored you
00:14:11.760 >> in her 60s,
00:14:13.040 >> right?
00:14:13.440 >> I don’t know what I did to her. And I
00:14:16.079 literally as someone that is her niece
00:14:20.160 texted her saying, "I’m so sorry, X, Y,
00:14:23.600 and Z. Can we please communicate because
00:14:25.920 I love you very much." Never responded.
00:14:29.519 I was cut out because from what I’m
00:14:33.199 understanding, I asked for prayer for my
00:14:36.399 cousin when her husband passed away. And
00:14:39.680 it was inappropriate the timing that I
00:14:42.880 did it on her Facebook page. and I used
00:14:44.959 one of her profile pictures to say it.
00:14:47.680 So, none of them are talking to me after
00:14:49.360 that. They’ve got they’ve
00:14:50.720 >> blasted I I’ve been cut out of the
00:14:52.560 family because I asked for prayer wrong
00:14:56.160 >> and I was called out on it and they
00:14:58.880 still don’t talk to me to this day.
00:15:00.240 >> And you know what? If asking for prayer
00:15:02.000 for somebody who’s hurting is wrong,
00:15:04.720 then I don’t want to be right. The fact
00:15:06.560 though that I reached I reached out and
00:15:09.120 asked
00:15:10.800 for clarification and for communication
00:15:15.279 and to be ignored. I was wanting to
00:15:17.199 learn what I could do better. I’m not
00:15:19.279 sitting here pointing fingers. I want to
00:15:21.600 know what else I can do. I want to know.
00:15:25.680 I want to communicate just like, you
00:15:27.760 know, and this is just going off of
00:15:29.920 what’s going on with the world right
00:15:31.839 now. I want people to know where my
00:15:34.720 position is when it comes to vaccines
00:15:36.959 and Tylenol. I want them to understand
00:15:40.160 what we’ve lived through. And that
00:15:43.519 doesn’t mean you don’t go and get your
00:15:45.839 vaccination. I’m just giving you my side
00:15:48.720 of it. And what gets hard is people get
00:15:52.160 very hateful if you don’t align with
00:15:54.160 their thoughts. If you don’t align and
00:15:56.720 agree with them, they immediately cut
00:15:58.320 you off. And that’s why this world is
00:16:00.959 such in shambles because we are
00:16:04.880 unwilling to change. We are unwilling to
00:16:07.440 admit we have bias and we are unwilling
00:16:10.240 to listen to what somebody else has to
00:16:11.920 say. And I want to be that bridge if I
00:16:16.560 can. I’m obviously going to have my own
00:16:18.240 bias. I’m obviously going to think
00:16:20.560 certain things. I’m a human. You think
00:16:23.279 certain things. Everybody thinks certain
00:16:25.120 things. But I get beat up because I want
00:16:29.360 to communicate. I get beat up because I
00:16:32.000 want to be that responsible person. I
00:16:34.560 want to put myself out there. But by
00:16:37.360 putting myself out there, I get
00:16:38.720 ridiculed. I get criticized the most,
00:16:42.399 you know, and I’m not a victim. And I’m
00:16:46.320 sounding like it right now, but I’m not.
00:16:48.160 >> Well, you’re not going to change what
00:16:49.440 you’re doing.
00:16:50.160 >> No. And it’s okay to do your best. It’s
00:16:53.279 okay to do what you feel God’s calling
00:16:55.519 you to do. doing it not being good
00:16:57.680 enough for other people, you have to
00:17:01.519 then just say this is the way that it
00:17:03.279 has to be and you have to be okay with
00:17:05.599 that.
00:17:06.559 >> Yeah, absolutely. That’s great advice.
00:17:09.439 And you know along the lines of the open
00:17:11.760 communication you’ve you’ve been posting
00:17:13.280 because there have been so much in the
00:17:14.480 news this past week the Tylenol issue
00:17:17.439 with with autism spectrum and with
00:17:20.559 Charlie Kirk stuff with you know all
00:17:22.880 these different things Jimmy Kimmel that
00:17:25.439 whole issue and you’ve been posting
00:17:27.599 about it and what I’ve really
00:17:29.840 appreciated is the dialogue that you’ve
00:17:33.520 gotten into with people and not
00:17:35.760 everybody that is commenting align with
00:17:38.400 you And there are plenty of people that
00:17:40.480 are against you. One of our very good
00:17:43.120 friends up in uh the Chicago, Wisconsin
00:17:46.320 area is is not aligned with us
00:17:48.960 politically or you know a lot of other
00:17:52.480 areas. He’s not aligned with us and it’s
00:17:55.440 great.
00:17:56.000 >> He actually called us.
00:17:57.200 >> Yeah.
00:17:57.520 >> He called us and we’re like, I love you.
00:17:59.760 We love each other as friends. We all we
00:18:01.600 all love each other.
00:18:03.120 >> And he posts his opinions. We respond to
00:18:07.039 it. He responds to us. Other people
00:18:09.039 chime in. And at one point, somebody
00:18:13.120 jumped in
00:18:15.120 against him and
00:18:18.080 called him a name.
00:18:19.120 >> Uh-huh.
00:18:20.559 >> And I really appreciated you jumped in
00:18:24.559 immediately and said, "Whoa, whoa, whoa.
00:18:27.520 That’s not what this is for."
00:18:29.440 >> Correct.
00:18:29.919 >> This is for open dialogue. This is for
00:18:32.160 open discussion, and that’s not
00:18:34.880 appropriate.
00:18:35.919 >> Correct. It’s not you. You know, we’re
00:18:38.240 going to come on here. I want to have a
00:18:39.919 safe space to communicate. And your
00:18:42.559 emotions might get high. I would say
00:18:45.919 take a breath and don’t post. I mean,
00:18:49.280 I’m not perfect. I It’s not that I
00:18:51.360 haven’t thought people are jerks or
00:18:54.240 labeled people, but I think that as a
00:18:57.760 society, when you start calling people
00:19:00.000 names, it stops the conversation. We’ve
00:19:03.760 gotten to a point in society and I think
00:19:06.240 we all realize this that and I honestly
00:19:10.400 my personal opinion it’s driven by the
00:19:12.799 the 24hour a day news media and social
00:19:17.280 media where they are driving people to
00:19:20.960 be divided. They love the fact that
00:19:23.919 there are two sides that they can pit
00:19:26.240 against each other. And while they’re
00:19:27.679 pitting us against each other, they’re
00:19:29.760 polarizing the issue. And they’re
00:19:31.520 saying, and that’s actually a technique
00:19:33.679 that can be studied and used in trial
00:19:37.039 work, you know, going to trial on cases
00:19:39.440 is polarizing the issue to where you
00:19:42.400 either agree with me or you’re absurd.
00:19:45.840 And the flip side is correct as well.
00:19:47.840 They say the same thing. You either
00:19:49.440 agree with me or you’re absurd. And
00:19:51.919 there’s no middle ground whatsoever. And
00:19:54.160 so that’s happening in politics. that’s
00:19:56.559 happening in the media, that’s happening
00:19:58.480 on social networking. That’s why you
00:20:00.480 have these jockeyies behind their their
00:20:02.960 keyboards that feel free to spout off
00:20:06.480 anger and hate and that type of thing
00:20:08.799 because they’ve been polarized and they
00:20:11.120 they don’t see that there’s a whole
00:20:13.840 spectrum of opinions and positions and
00:20:17.919 and things to discuss. And so it’s about
00:20:21.280 opening up the dialogue and getting out
00:20:24.000 of that space where it’s so divided and
00:20:26.640 it’s so polarized.
00:20:28.240 >> Well, you have to realize, you know,
00:20:29.520 today, you know, I was making posts and,
00:20:31.440 you know, Trump does the post about
00:20:33.280 Tylenol and something else and
00:20:34.799 everyone’s immediately like, oh, you
00:20:36.960 know, it’s because they don’t want to
00:20:38.320 have, you know, they don’t want to talk
00:20:39.360 about the Epstein files. And, you know,
00:20:41.520 you can point everything to the Epstein
00:20:43.440 files, but bottom line is most people
00:20:45.520 have made up their mind. You know, if
00:20:48.000 you think Trump’s on the list, no one’s
00:20:50.240 changing your mind. If he’s not on the
00:20:51.520 list when they put it out there, he took
00:20:53.919 his name off the list. If you believe
00:20:56.240 that his name isn’t on the list and they
00:20:58.240 don’t, you know, his name’s not on the
00:20:59.840 list. Everyone’s made up their mind what
00:21:01.679 they think. And it’s not that we should
00:21:03.840 stop talking about it. I’m That’s not
00:21:05.600 what I’m saying. But if you’re not here
00:21:08.720 to admit you’re biased by the news you
00:21:11.919 watch, by the people you listen to, I’m
00:21:13.840 biased. I don’t listen to liberal media.
00:21:17.120 I don’t I mean some of it I guess I see
00:21:19.360 it on Facebook or I see it on, you know,
00:21:21.120 X or Tik Tok, but I get it. We all see
00:21:25.120 different information. We all have
00:21:26.640 things filtered to us differently.
00:21:29.600 And yet we’re becoming an intolerant
00:21:32.799 society.
00:21:33.840 >> Intolerant to opposing viewpoints.
00:21:36.640 >> Yes. And the second, just like with
00:21:38.320 Charlie Kirk, the second you say
00:21:40.159 something that hurts someone’s feelings,
00:21:43.600 then you’re evil.
00:21:44.880 >> Yeah. And they they use this term,
00:21:46.400 you’re spewing hatred. Yes.
00:21:48.080 >> You’re evil. You’re spewing hatred. And
00:21:51.280 in in extreme cases, as we’ve seen,
00:21:53.679 you’re worthy of death.
00:21:55.039 >> Yes.
00:21:55.520 >> For using words, for expressing
00:21:57.440 opinions.
00:21:58.320 >> Yes.
00:21:59.200 >> It’s it’s abhorentt. It really is. I
00:22:01.280 feel like the same people that would
00:22:02.640 have picked Barabus over Jesus are still
00:22:06.799 alive and well.
00:22:08.240 >> Yeah.
00:22:09.760 >> Would Jesus be considered prissy by
00:22:12.799 these people because he’s giving them
00:22:14.960 information? I mean, you know that the
00:22:17.840 disciples didn’t dress up back then, but
00:22:20.159 you know they held themselves up. You
00:22:22.240 know that they spoke eloquently. You
00:22:24.799 know that they were leaders. They were
00:22:28.400 confident. And God gives us that
00:22:30.720 confidence. The Holy Spirit gives us
00:22:32.400 that confidence. And if that’s seen as
00:22:36.080 prissiness versus knowledgeable, then
00:22:39.280 those same people that could benefit
00:22:40.880 from being friends with other people
00:22:43.440 like myself, like you, they end up not
00:22:46.960 growing. And I think that that’s sad. I
00:22:50.880 think people end up going in their
00:22:52.559 little holes mentally. I mean they
00:22:57.280 mentally go into this space of darkness
00:23:01.360 thinking that something that’s bright
00:23:05.039 and you know they people have told me
00:23:07.840 that when they come and talk to me I’m a
00:23:11.120 bright light. I try to be positive. I
00:23:13.039 try to help them. I try to encourage
00:23:15.840 them. But a lot of people don’t want
00:23:18.480 that. They do want to be victims.
00:23:20.880 >> Sure. And so they see me out here
00:23:22.799 speaking about the possibilities
00:23:26.320 in your life and not staying stuck. And
00:23:29.039 that’s threatening to them. I think
00:23:30.799 >> I think you’re probably right. And so
00:23:32.640 something that was interesting that you
00:23:35.200 brought up this past week, Ken, and that
00:23:37.520 you posted, and I was really proud of
00:23:39.120 you, was
00:23:41.200 letting everybody know your journey and
00:23:44.880 growing up Jewish and now finding Christ
00:23:50.960 and your epiphany with that and your
00:23:54.240 view on how you feel like that community
00:23:59.440 treats
00:24:01.039 other Jews. and treats people. Would you
00:24:03.760 like to tell everybody about that?
00:24:06.080 >> Yeah, sure. I started off thinking about
00:24:09.919 where I am now with my faith in Jesus.
00:24:13.840 And it’s not an easy move. It’s not an
00:24:19.279 easy thing for somebody raised Jewish to
00:24:23.200 do. And so I started thinking about
00:24:25.600 really the the basis of why that is. Why
00:24:28.640 is it so difficult? and and there’s
00:24:31.200 really such a stigma about it that so
00:24:34.960 much so that at least you know again my
00:24:38.000 upbringing Jewish I can only talk about
00:24:40.320 my upbringing Jesus wasn’t discussed it
00:24:44.000 it was a non-factor and there was this
00:24:46.960 whole walling off of Jewish people and
00:24:52.320 the Jewish community and I started to
00:24:55.200 think about why that was because you’re
00:24:58.159 you’re essentially taught
00:25:00.159 not to go outside of that community.
00:25:03.120 You’re not to intermar
00:25:06.720 uh with with non-Jews. You’re they make
00:25:10.320 it very very difficult for people who
00:25:14.240 want to become Jewish to convert to to
00:25:16.720 Judaism. I mean, it’s a really really
00:25:18.960 big thing. So much so that I’ve read
00:25:20.960 that rabbis are actually told when
00:25:24.400 somebody wants to come to you and
00:25:26.159 convert to Judaism, you should
00:25:27.840 discourage them. And those types of
00:25:29.679 things really got me thinking about how
00:25:32.799 it’s this closed off
00:25:36.880 community
00:25:38.480 and
00:25:40.880 there’s this
00:25:43.279 thought process this almost fear of
00:25:47.440 assimilation watering down of uh the
00:25:51.200 Jewish people and eventually the
00:25:54.000 eradication of the Jewish people and
00:25:56.159 there’s this fight and you know so much
00:25:57.919 of that is obviously based on on what’s
00:26:00.400 been, you know, the history with
00:26:02.640 persecution throughout the years and and
00:26:05.760 the Holocaust is always on on people’s
00:26:08.640 minds and tongues about that. And so I
00:26:11.360 understand where that fear is coming
00:26:14.400 from, but honestly what I was looking at
00:26:17.520 is
00:26:19.200 not just why it’s so difficult for
00:26:22.960 Jewish people to look into Jesus and to
00:26:28.320 eventually accept Jesus.
00:26:30.799 >> Well, because you’re you’re you’re
00:26:32.320 actually you would be turning almost on
00:26:35.679 your tribe. It’s like you’re taught
00:26:38.240 >> it’s not like,
00:26:39.760 >> hey, just don’t look over there.
00:26:41.919 >> If you do decide to look over there
00:26:43.919 towards Jesus, you’re actually being an
00:26:46.720 unloving person to all of us,
00:26:48.799 >> right?
00:26:49.279 >> You have a community that is depending
00:26:51.039 on you.
00:26:51.600 >> You’re told that Jews for Jesus, Jewish
00:26:54.880 people who have come to faith and
00:26:56.799 accepted Jesus as their as their savior,
00:26:59.039 that’s a cult. Don’t talk to them. that
00:27:02.000 Messianic Jewish temple. Again, Jewish
00:27:05.520 people who still practice Judaism, but
00:27:09.840 do it
00:27:11.600 >> in in in the vein of Jesus as their
00:27:14.240 savior.
00:27:14.640 >> We’ve been to one. We go
00:27:15.600 >> and we’ve been to one. And I I felt I
00:27:17.679 told you just earlier today, I felt more
00:27:20.480 Jewish going to that than I have in
00:27:22.960 many, many years because all the
00:27:25.200 >> your whole life.
00:27:25.919 >> Yeah. All the Jewish traditions are
00:27:27.760 there. you’re still practicing as a Jew
00:27:30.480 and going to synagogue.
00:27:32.640 You’re just accepting that Jesus is the
00:27:35.120 Messiah. And there’s just I I was told,
00:27:40.000 well, Messianic Jews, they’re not really
00:27:41.919 Jews.
00:27:43.440 And that’s not true. And what I
00:27:45.440 eventually came to with all of this is
00:27:49.520 what I’ve known for a while now is
00:27:52.640 there’s so much that points to Jesus as
00:27:55.679 the Messiah. And there’s so much that
00:27:59.360 shows that turning to Jesus is not
00:28:04.320 ending and watering down and being
00:28:06.720 assimilated from Judaism to
00:28:08.799 Christianity. It’s a natural extension.
00:28:11.840 It is the next path of Judaism. It is
00:28:16.000 being more Jewish by accepting Jesus.
00:28:19.039 Jesus was Jewish. His disciples were
00:28:21.360 Jewish. His teachings were Jewish. The
00:28:23.679 early church was Jewish. It is a natural
00:28:26.720 extension of Judaism accepting Jesus.
00:28:30.080 >> Well, what do you say to the Jews out
00:28:31.360 there that said, "Ken, he can’t be
00:28:32.720 because there’s supposed to be no more
00:28:34.240 pain." Isn’t that what they say? There’s
00:28:36.080 no more strife, no more pain.
00:28:38.000 >> That’s actually something that I found
00:28:39.679 really, really interesting is looking
00:28:42.000 into that. And so, it’s the Messiah.
00:28:44.480 Jewish belief is when the Messiah comes,
00:28:47.919 he’s supposed to eradicate all evil in
00:28:50.240 the world. And so that’s the big
00:28:52.080 objection to Jesus as the Messiah is
00:28:54.640 look around you. Just what we’ve been
00:28:56.159 talking about here on this podcast. Look
00:28:58.240 around you. There’s evil in the world.
00:29:01.039 And that’s the basis of saying that
00:29:04.240 Jesus could not have been the Messiah.
00:29:06.559 But what I’ve looked into and what that
00:29:10.320 opinion ignores is Jewish teachings are
00:29:14.480 actually two different versions of the
00:29:17.039 Messiah. There is the conquering king
00:29:19.919 that comes and rids the world of evil.
00:29:23.120 But there’s also at the same time there
00:29:25.679 is the suffering servant Messiah. Both
00:29:28.799 in Jewish tradition, both in Jewish
00:29:30.960 teachings and they both point to the
00:29:33.679 Messiah. And so what is interesting
00:29:36.960 about that is that if the conquering
00:29:41.679 king Messiah came first and rid the
00:29:45.520 world of evil, who’s he going to get rid
00:29:48.320 of
00:29:49.360 >> because there’s evil in every one of us.
00:29:51.279 >> Everybody. None of us are worthy.
00:29:53.200 >> Right? So the suffering servant had to
00:29:56.320 come first. Had to give us a way to
00:30:00.640 reconcile with God. So that that way
00:30:03.840 when the conquering king comes,
00:30:06.960 we’re reconciled to God and evil is done
00:30:10.000 away with, but we who are reconciled to
00:30:13.120 God are not done away with. And so
00:30:17.679 I just found that so interesting that
00:30:21.919 there’s Judaism wants to say there can
00:30:25.919 be no second coming. There’s only a
00:30:27.760 Messiah coming one time.
00:30:30.399 and followers of Jesus know that it
00:30:34.240 can’t happen that way.
00:30:35.760 >> So, I have a question for you with this
00:30:37.440 as well because I feel like the term
00:30:39.840 anti-semitic is just thrown around by
00:30:42.480 people all the time. You know, they
00:30:44.320 called Charlie anti-semitic because he
00:30:46.320 decided he was going to talk about Gaza
00:30:49.600 and all of the things that, you know,
00:30:51.200 the war and everything going on. Why do
00:30:54.080 you feel we aren’t allowed to criticize
00:30:58.880 or talk about Israel in a way where
00:31:02.080 they’re not perfect? They’re people.
00:31:03.520 They can’t be perfect. Nobody’s perfect.
00:31:06.399 Why can’t someone speak about Jewish
00:31:10.080 people
00:31:11.760 unless it’s positive without being
00:31:13.919 called an anti-Semitic?
00:31:17.679 That’s a tough question and I think a
00:31:20.080 lot of it stems from
00:31:24.159 what I term as the scarcity.
00:31:29.279 >> No, but I don’t think non-Jews are
00:31:31.440 saying it. It’s like just people in
00:31:33.440 general are just you’re an anti-Semitic.
00:31:36.480 We’re supposed to be, you know, praising
00:31:38.720 Israel. I don’t even think half the
00:31:40.240 people understand that concept cuz
00:31:41.679 they’re not even Jewish. I don’t even
00:31:43.840 think they understand that is my point.
00:31:46.960 >> Yeah. But as far as where it comes from,
00:31:49.760 >> you don’t think that maybe some part of
00:31:56.080 it’s not having to do with control
00:31:57.840 either? Like I mean I’m not far from an
00:32:00.559 anti-
00:32:01.919 >> I’m married to a Jewish guy.
00:32:03.360 >> That’s what I’m saying.
00:32:04.080 >> But not just about the scarcity. Could
00:32:07.120 there partially be a control of image as
00:32:11.519 well?
00:32:12.000 >> Yes. But it it’s it’s created through
00:32:16.240 this idea of scarcity that I’m getting
00:32:18.480 at. Oh, you’re right. No, that’s my
00:32:20.640 point is
00:32:21.840 >> they’re brainwashing people of this
00:32:23.600 scarcity.
00:32:24.559 >> Anything that is scarce
00:32:28.240 and valued as
00:32:31.679 important
00:32:33.360 or seen as important will be valued
00:32:35.519 higher.
00:32:36.159 >> But just
00:32:36.640 >> look at precious metals. Look at
00:32:38.480 precious stones, gemstones.
00:32:41.360 scarcity
00:32:43.039 helps increase the value. And so if you
00:32:46.159 look at
00:32:47.919 >> making it difficult for people to become
00:32:50.799 Jewish, if you look at
00:32:53.840 >> the closed society of being Jewish and
00:32:58.240 the push to keep people from looking
00:33:02.880 beyond Judaism, it’s to keep that closed
00:33:07.279 society and also at the same time the
00:33:11.519 replaying over and over and over again
00:33:13.600 of the Holocaust and persecution through
00:33:15.919 the years and all these things that they
00:33:17.840 are in danger. It creates this image of
00:33:21.840 a valuable people and there’s that whole
00:33:25.519 debate that went on not too long ago
00:33:28.000 about well what are the Jewish people?
00:33:30.080 What is Israel? Is it is it the
00:33:32.799 geographic area of Israel or is it the
00:33:35.840 people that are Jewish? And we come to
00:33:39.840 find out that Ashkanazi Ashkanazi many
00:33:43.120 of them are not
00:33:44.960 right,
00:33:45.279 >> of Abraham’s descent, right?
00:33:46.960 >> Which you’re 99% Ashkanazi,
00:33:49.279 >> right? So that
00:33:50.240 >> some of them are. We’re not saying that
00:33:52.159 you can, you know, you can comment and
00:33:55.200 do your history, but there’s no
00:33:57.600 confirmation that as an Ashkanazi Jewish
00:34:00.640 person, you are 100% Jewish from
00:34:03.760 Abraham,
00:34:04.880 >> right?
00:34:05.360 >> And you you never doubted your your
00:34:07.120 100%.
00:34:09.040 And so when you started learning about
00:34:10.800 that, you were like you felt lied to.
00:34:14.239 >> Well, it was a bit of an earthshattering
00:34:16.960 >> revelation.
00:34:17.679 >> I would say more than a bit.
00:34:19.040 >> Yeah.
00:34:19.679 >> You you were really freaked out.
00:34:22.000 >> Yeah. Well, I didn’t I didn’t want to
00:34:23.440 hear it.
00:34:24.239 >> I did not want to have that
00:34:25.359 conversation. I didn’t want to hear it
00:34:26.560 at all
00:34:27.199 >> cuz we were looking up the tribe of
00:34:28.879 Ashkanazi. It wasn’t like we were
00:34:30.719 looking for something like that. And the
00:34:33.280 more we started to look into that, we
00:34:35.679 were like, "Wow."
00:34:36.960 >> I would I would encourage any
00:34:42.079 Jewish person out there to research
00:34:44.800 that. I mean, it just take five minutes
00:34:46.879 on chat GPT, look up what is it, the
00:34:49.280 Khazars or the Khazak, whatever.
00:34:51.119 >> Part of the Khazars, they were they
00:34:53.839 actually
00:34:55.359 owned a big port, right? and like for
00:34:59.359 trade and they were opened up to
00:35:01.839 Muslims, Christians and Jews and then
00:35:05.280 around the 8th century they became just
00:35:08.400 Jewish. The elites decided they were all
00:35:11.040 going to be Jewish.
00:35:13.200 >> There was a mass conversion
00:35:14.880 >> to Judaism and that’s the basis of where
00:35:18.960 Ashkanazi Jews are and that’s the vast
00:35:22.880 majority of Jews this to this day are
00:35:26.160 the European Jews. the Ashkanazi Jews.
00:35:29.280 And so the bloodline, the inception of
00:35:33.119 Ashkanazi Jews are for the most part not
00:35:36.240 Jewish. So that kind of changes your
00:35:40.000 mindset a little bit when you think
00:35:42.240 about who
00:35:43.119 >> Well, if you look it up, they will say
00:35:45.200 if you were welcomed into the Jewish
00:35:49.280 community, you are spiritually Jewish.
00:35:52.480 >> Yeah. which is another reason that I
00:35:54.800 read why they make it so difficult for
00:35:57.040 con conversion to Judaism is because
00:35:59.839 they want somebody to really suffer
00:36:04.160 through the the pains of studying
00:36:07.200 Judaism and finally being accepted in so
00:36:10.880 that way you can feel like you know you
00:36:13.599 you have that spiritual connection. So
00:36:17.680 asking I’m gonna ask you this too
00:36:18.880 because I believe on like Tucker Carlson
00:36:20.800 they were talking about this. Do you
00:36:22.880 believe there’s a difference between
00:36:24.960 supporting the Israeli government and
00:36:27.599 Israel? Like in the Bible when they talk
00:36:29.680 about that they you know they say we
00:36:31.440 should always be supporting Israel. Do
00:36:33.839 you believe that those are two separate
00:36:35.599 entities?
00:36:36.800 >> I don’t see how you can necessarily tie
00:36:40.240 the two together as one honestly. I
00:36:44.079 mean, if we’re not talking about the
00:36:46.160 bloodline of Abraham, if we’re not
00:36:48.960 talking about the Jewish people
00:36:53.440 that trace their lineage all the way
00:36:55.760 back to
00:36:57.839 Israel in in the time of the Old
00:37:00.800 Testament,
00:37:02.640 then
00:37:04.320 it’s you’re just implanting people and
00:37:06.800 it could be anyone just by virtue of
00:37:11.599 making a a decision they’re
00:37:15.119 part of the chosen people and have to be
00:37:18.160 protected and can’t be scrutinized. It
00:37:22.000 just doesn’t sit right with me. And
00:37:25.200 honestly, what is great about thinking
00:37:28.240 about
00:37:29.839 Jesus as the Messiah and that being an
00:37:32.560 extension of Judaism, what was God’s
00:37:36.400 promise to Abraham when he made the
00:37:39.040 covenant is that he will bless all of
00:37:42.240 the nations through Abraham and through
00:37:45.040 his bloodline and his seed and they will
00:37:47.680 bless all of the nations. Well, with
00:37:50.240 Judaism being such a closed community,
00:37:53.520 with not wanting to
00:37:56.640 evangelize and spread
00:37:59.520 Judaism, with not being restrictive
00:38:03.280 about people converting to Judaism,
00:38:06.400 about trying to keep people from going
00:38:08.079 outside of Judaism. How does that bless
00:38:11.760 all of the nations through Abraham? And
00:38:14.960 it doesn’t. The only way that it does is
00:38:18.800 by Jesus giving the great commission, go
00:38:23.599 out and make disciples of all nations.
00:38:27.200 That’s how it spreads. That’s why
00:38:29.920 Christianity, a belief in Jesus, is a
00:38:32.720 natural extension of Judaism. And that’s
00:38:34.960 the only way God’s covenant is fulfilled
00:38:37.760 through Abraham to spread throughout all
00:38:40.160 the nations and bless all the nations.
00:38:42.320 >> And Jesus spoke about the two. He stood
00:38:45.680 up for the land of Israel but then spoke
00:38:47.520 against the Pharisees and the rabbis and
00:38:52.000 things like that.
00:38:53.040 >> Yeah, without a doubt. Without a doubt.
00:38:55.359 >> So, can I ask you something else which
00:38:58.640 it’s on topic but it’s controversial or
00:39:01.760 I guess it’s conspiracy. Are you nervous
00:39:04.560 talking about this stuff and having this
00:39:06.640 out there? Because it seems like anybody
00:39:09.040 that really questions Israel.
00:39:14.720 I mean, look at what just happened to
00:39:16.000 Charlie. And people say that he lost
00:39:18.000 funding because he was turning and
00:39:20.640 questioning things. I don’t know if
00:39:22.480 that’s true or not, but be honest. Does
00:39:25.520 it make you nervous a little bit to be
00:39:28.320 talking about this subject?
00:39:29.680 >> Sure. It’s and it’s not comfortable
00:39:33.920 either.
00:39:34.800 >> Why is that? Because you feel like
00:39:36.160 you’re going to be judged or you feel
00:39:37.440 like you’re turning against your people?
00:39:39.760 >> Both. Both. It I’m telling you, it is so
00:39:42.480 deeply ingrained in your identity of
00:39:46.079 being Jewish that it feels disloyal.
00:39:51.119 It’s hard to overcome. And the only way
00:39:54.640 that I can do it and talk about it is
00:39:59.040 because of how much I’ve looked into all
00:40:01.680 of it and how confident I am that Jesus
00:40:05.520 is the Messiah.
00:40:06.400 >> And you’re a lawyer.
00:40:07.440 >> Yeah.
00:40:07.760 >> So, you know how to investigate things.
00:40:09.599 >> Yeah.
00:40:10.160 >> And you chose to want truth versus just
00:40:15.200 having an emotion and saying, you know,
00:40:17.440 I’m just going to do it because
00:40:18.720 everyone’s telling me, well, you are
00:40:20.560 married to me and I’m miss. Let’s dig
00:40:22.720 in.
00:40:23.359 >> Yeah.
00:40:23.680 >> Let’s dig up the truth. Let’s look and
00:40:26.160 see. Cuz I’m always wanting to grow. I
00:40:28.720 never want to stay where I’m at.
00:40:30.400 >> I’m always like, there’s more. There’s
00:40:31.920 more.
00:40:32.720 >> Yeah.
00:40:33.040 >> Let’s figure it out.
00:40:34.160 >> But it’s still you still in the back of
00:40:36.880 your mind still have those same things.
00:40:39.920 I mean, in all of psychology, what
00:40:43.440 happens in your your early formative
00:40:45.839 years affects people throughout their
00:40:47.760 entire lives. I mean, I still have that
00:40:50.000 in the back of my mind. Sure.
00:40:52.079 >> Of all that I was raised with. So, it’s
00:40:54.240 still difficult.
00:40:54.880 >> Oh, sure. It’s like for me sit here and
00:40:56.720 call out my family, my extended family
00:40:59.119 in Illinois. I mean, like, what am I
00:41:02.079 going to do? Have them stop talking to
00:41:04.319 me? Oh, they’re already not talking to
00:41:05.599 me.
00:41:05.839 >> I know.
00:41:06.400 >> I mean, it’s like, and if you stop
00:41:08.880 talking to me and you have yet to call
00:41:10.960 me and say, I heard this or I heard
00:41:13.119 that. What’s true? It’s like there’s
00:41:17.280 people that are more concerned with
00:41:20.880 the lies. I don’t know. Just the
00:41:23.359 control. I think it comes down to
00:41:24.720 control. Control of money, control of
00:41:26.480 power, control of image. It all comes
00:41:28.880 down to
00:41:29.599 >> control of their emotion, too. They’re
00:41:31.280 they’re afraid to
00:41:33.920 address things openly because of their
00:41:37.440 emotions.
00:41:38.000 >> And what if they’re wrong? It’s like
00:41:39.680 that’s the thing is if you were to call
00:41:41.200 me or you were to call you or we were to
00:41:43.119 talk about somebody or let’s say
00:41:44.240 somebody Jewish wants to talk to you,
00:41:46.960 they’re afraid of opening up those
00:41:49.440 ideas,
00:41:50.319 >> right?
00:41:50.720 >> What does it mean if Jesus is part of
00:41:54.480 your life,
00:41:55.520 >> right?
00:41:55.839 >> What does it mean if the lies you’ve
00:41:58.480 been telling about Megan to make you
00:42:00.000 feel better, Megan’s, you know, working
00:42:02.640 a lot? I’m sitting on my couch. I don’t
00:42:04.640 like her because she makes me feel like
00:42:06.000 I should be working more. Well, that’s
00:42:07.680 your problem. Why is that my problem? I
00:42:10.079 don’t want you to work. Don’t work if
00:42:11.200 you don’t want to work. I don’t care.
00:42:12.560 Live your life how you want to live your
00:42:13.839 life. As long as I’m not paid for it,
00:42:16.560 but you know, definitely God tells us
00:42:18.240 not to fear in the Bible 365,
00:42:20.480 >> right,
00:42:20.960 >> times. And it’s definitely a spiritual
00:42:23.520 battle what’s going on on this earth,
00:42:25.359 >> right? We’re given the the power to
00:42:27.839 trample snakes, right?
00:42:29.280 >> Amen.
00:42:30.000 >> Yeah. So that that helps in thinking
00:42:33.280 about these things and talking about
00:42:35.200 them here is knowing that our faith is
00:42:39.040 in in Jesus, not to fear. And so that’s
00:42:43.359 how you overcome it. My question for you
00:42:45.520 is this. Do you know anybody who was
00:42:47.280 raptured?
00:42:48.079 >> Oh my gosh.
00:42:50.400 I think my mind was raptured.
00:42:54.000 September 23rd came and went. And poor
00:42:56.960 Skyla just she you know our daughter
00:42:58.880 Skyla she’s been scared about it because
00:43:00.960 Tik Tok and she gets into her head and
00:43:03.599 she said something in the afternoon like
00:43:05.680 four o’clock and oh we weren’t raptured
00:43:08.160 and Jack says oh but someday I think
00:43:11.280 it’s the new year this this day lasts
00:43:14.160 till tomorrow.
00:43:15.040 >> Yeah
00:43:15.440 >> Jack stop it and he smirks siblings for
00:43:18.560 you
00:43:18.880 >> gives her such a hard time about that.
00:43:20.800 >> I don’t know if someone was raptured
00:43:22.160 they should let me know. Oh wait they
00:43:23.760 couldn’t let me know they’ve been
00:43:24.720 raptured. Actually, you showed me
00:43:28.240 Tik Toks of people saying they were
00:43:30.560 selling their vehicles and giving away
00:43:32.400 their life savings. It had to have been.
00:43:34.560 >> No, it was a joke.
00:43:35.520 >> Had to have been.
00:43:36.240 >> It was a joke. And you’ve thought that
00:43:37.359 I’ve been raptured from you a few times.
00:43:39.359 >> Yeah. Well, when I can’t find you around
00:43:41.599 the house, sometimes I I worry that you
00:43:43.760 got raptured.
00:43:46.079 >> You said to me the other day, "Thank you
00:43:47.440 for not getting raptured without me."
00:43:48.800 Right.
00:43:49.119 >> I want to say one last thing.
00:43:51.920 Women, if you do not believe Trump about
00:43:56.000 Tylenol, please do not take an overdose
00:43:58.560 of Tylenol to prove how safe it is.
00:44:00.960 There’s somebody in ICU right now
00:44:02.960 because they downed a bunch of Tylenol
00:44:04.960 and it looks like she’s going to die
00:44:06.720 because of what Trump said. And if you
00:44:08.880 look, there’s actual facts of Tylenol
00:44:13.119 posting in 2017, it is not safe to take
00:44:17.200 while you’re pregnant. So, it’s already
00:44:18.800 been out there. I do want you just to
00:44:21.280 take a minute and you’ve been such a
00:44:25.119 great voice for mothers of children with
00:44:29.599 autism and on the spectrum
00:44:32.400 >> and what always struck me with you as so
00:44:36.480 vital and I think you are such a
00:44:38.640 powerful voice for this
00:44:41.040 >> is your determination for early
00:44:45.839 intervention with Jack. And I think how
00:44:49.680 Jack is today is a testament to that.
00:44:53.280 And I really want you to advocate that
00:44:56.400 for these mothers who
00:44:59.920 may just suspect.
00:45:02.000 >> So I can’t tell them how to live. They
00:45:04.800 may have a job. They can’t fully do what
00:45:06.880 I did. I’m going to tell them what I did
00:45:08.880 and what worked for me. And obviously
00:45:12.000 God has a lot to do with it. It’s always
00:45:14.000 up to God. So when Jack was 6 months, he
00:45:17.359 was vaccinated. He was testing out at
00:45:19.440 that visit. It’s on his medical records
00:45:21.200 that he was testing out as a 9month-old.
00:45:23.760 Instantly,
00:45:25.440 he got a fever, glassy eyed, and he was
00:45:29.040 not himself. After that, on Monday,
00:45:32.000 after he was given the vaccines on that
00:45:34.240 Wednesday, I took him back to the doctor
00:45:36.079 because I’m like, "Something’s wrong."
00:45:37.599 The doctor actually did his same testing
00:45:41.359 and he was testing out as a
00:45:42.640 two-month-old. And I was I was literally
00:45:45.440 like devastated because here my child
00:45:48.480 was doing push-ups saying mama da da or
00:45:51.520 da da whatever making sounds and he
00:45:54.160 wasn’t saying anything and it was like
00:45:56.160 he was just glassy eyed staring at me
00:45:58.880 and he said the vaccines hit him harder.
00:46:01.520 Well from over the years I ended up
00:46:05.040 learning educating myself. I mean, this
00:46:06.880 was 19 years ago. There wasn’t all this
00:46:08.400 stuff available at the time. And I found
00:46:11.760 out for one reason or another, and now I
00:46:13.920 know it’s it’s the genetics that Jack
00:46:16.000 has. It’s my genetics as well. We have
00:46:18.800 trouble detoxing. Okay? And these
00:46:21.200 vaccines have adgivants. They have
00:46:23.760 toxins. They have these things that you
00:46:25.839 need to get out of your body. And when
00:46:27.839 you can’t do that, it causes brain
00:46:31.760 damage or brain issues. And
00:46:35.520 I decided I wasn’t going to give Jack
00:46:36.960 another vaccination.
00:46:39.040 And my belief, and I’m not a doctor, I’m
00:46:41.599 not a nurse. I’m not a scientist. My
00:46:44.000 belief is that just like a stroke or
00:46:46.960 just like something getting your brain
00:46:49.200 damaged, your brain heals over the
00:46:52.079 years. And by me not
00:46:55.119 giving him more vaccines, constantly
00:46:57.200 bombarding his brain with more toxins,
00:47:01.359 his brain was able to heal. I also did
00:47:04.319 Dr. Sears attachment parenting. I held
00:47:07.040 him all the time. So when I when he was
00:47:09.119 three and he was finally diagnosed, he
00:47:10.880 didn’t talk to till he was five. The
00:47:13.440 developmental pediatrician said, "This
00:47:16.000 is amazing. He’s looking at me." and she
00:47:20.640 attributed it to me doing attachment
00:47:23.520 parenting.
00:47:24.079 >> Well, and that’s
00:47:24.800 >> and I nursed and I nursed both of my
00:47:26.800 kids for two years each.
00:47:27.839 >> But one of the things that I so very
00:47:30.000 respect about you is it was a time in
00:47:33.520 your life where you had a lot of
00:47:36.800 opposition to
00:47:39.520 what you were doing to raise Jack. And
00:47:43.200 without getting into specifics of who
00:47:45.119 and what, you knew
00:47:48.800 with what you went through with him, and
00:47:51.280 you trusted your motherly instinct that
00:47:53.920 something was not right. And there was
00:47:56.640 nothing that was going to stop you in
00:47:59.760 getting it figured out. And that meant
00:48:02.400 going to get him checked out and
00:48:05.040 evaluated. And you had people telling
00:48:06.960 you he’s too young for any kind of a
00:48:09.440 diagnosis anyway. But you knew and you
00:48:12.480 pushed on through that because you
00:48:14.720 trusted your motherly instincts and got
00:48:17.920 the diagnosis, got the help that he
00:48:20.640 needed, got the early intervention
00:48:23.280 so that that way he had the opportunity
00:48:26.319 to get therapy and treatment as early as
00:48:30.559 possible. And I think that was so vital.
00:48:32.559 And I think that’s so important for
00:48:34.000 women to hear.
00:48:34.960 >> Well, you don’t know love until you have
00:48:37.280 a child.
00:48:40.400 You just don’t know love until you have
00:48:41.839 a child
00:48:43.520 and you become
00:48:45.920 their lioness. You will do anything for
00:48:50.000 them.
00:48:51.520 And I knew in my heart because I’m so
00:48:55.280 I’m so connected to those that I love
00:48:58.480 that I was going to fight for him. And
00:49:02.800 it didn’t matter what people thought of
00:49:04.319 me. It didn’t matter what people’s
00:49:06.559 opinions were. If I was, if they thought
00:49:08.160 I was holding him too much, I’m going to
00:49:09.680 hold him as much as my mom’s heart. I
00:49:11.680 want to hold him. I don’t care. I’m not
00:49:14.000 going to let him cry it out. I want to
00:49:15.440 hold him. He’s He’s He’s a baby. I’m
00:49:19.359 going to co-sleep with him. I’m going to
00:49:22.319 be with him. I’m going to fight for him.
00:49:27.839 And it doesn’t matter what anybody else
00:49:30.079 said. God gave me the job to be his mom.
00:49:34.319 and
00:49:35.920 you want to see me fight, I’m going to
00:49:38.000 fight for those that I love.
00:49:39.760 >> What’s your advice to women who have a
00:49:42.880 young child, a young baby, and they feel
00:49:46.400 in their heart that something’s off?
00:49:50.079 >> Trust it. Trust it. Get them tested. Get
00:49:53.440 them tested for um genetic testing. It’s
00:49:56.400 just a simple blood test. Um
00:50:00.240 don’t go and get them vaccines if you
00:50:02.400 don’t feel comfortable. learn about
00:50:04.240 them. Don’t be afraid to say this is my
00:50:08.000 child. If everybody in your family is
00:50:10.319 saying you need to do this, no. If you
00:50:13.680 don’t feel like it’s right, don’t hold
00:50:16.000 them. If somebody says, "Oh, you’re
00:50:18.160 spoiling them." Then I’ll spoil my
00:50:20.000 little baby. You’re not spoiling them by
00:50:22.559 loving them. Babies don’t know that
00:50:24.800 you’re spoiling them. You know, Dr.
00:50:27.440 Sears book says, or maybe it wasn’t his
00:50:30.079 book, so I’m sorry, don’t quote me, but
00:50:32.880 babies don’t even know they’re separate
00:50:34.480 from you when they’re first born. So, if
00:50:37.119 you’re training them to be away from
00:50:38.480 you, they stop crying because they feel
00:50:40.000 like you’re not going to come. I adore
00:50:42.640 my kids, as I’m sure everybody adores
00:50:44.559 their kids. And I wanted to make sure I
00:50:47.760 gave my kids the best bases. All you
00:50:50.400 moms do. So, I’m just talking to the
00:50:52.559 moms that are feeling nervous about
00:50:56.480 stepping up to the plate to be the mom
00:50:58.319 they want to be because there’s so many
00:51:00.319 voices. There’s so many people telling
00:51:02.480 them, "You shouldn’t do this, you should
00:51:03.760 do that, you shouldn’t do this, and here
00:51:04.960 I am, another one." But if you’re quiet,
00:51:08.640 you know, you get that instinct. You get
00:51:11.520 that feeling in your stomach when
00:51:13.119 something’s not right. And you need to
00:51:15.200 stand up for that baby because God gave
00:51:17.280 you. You are their angel on earth to
00:51:19.760 protect them, to hold them, to take care
00:51:22.079 of them. And I took that job seriously.
00:51:25.760 >> And those people who say you’re spoiling
00:51:28.559 the baby or you don’t need to go do that
00:51:30.720 and go do that. They go home at the end
00:51:32.640 of the day. You live with that baby.
00:51:35.440 >> Yes. I live with that baby and I hold
00:51:38.000 that baby and I love that baby and I
00:51:40.880 love those kids and I love my I love my
00:51:43.440 children more than my own life.
00:51:46.480 >> You’re a wonderful mom. You’ve done a
00:51:48.079 phenomenal job with them, too.
00:51:50.160 >> Thank you. And you’re a wonderful dad.
00:51:52.079 >> Thanks.
00:51:52.640 >> You’re so cute.
00:51:55.760 >> You want to have some more babies?
00:52:00.319 >> Well, I think that’s a wrap. I think
00:52:02.960 we’ve touched on a lot of subjects.
00:52:04.559 >> Yeah, we did. And I appreciate you
00:52:06.000 joining us on cross-examine with the
00:52:07.599 Gerbers. And don’t forget, we own Gerber
00:52:09.839 Injury Law. So if you’re injured or a
00:52:11.680 loved one’s injured, I would love the
00:52:13.839 opportunity to treat you like my baby.
00:52:16.000 >> Catch us on gerberjurylaw.com.